http://educate-yourself.org/lte/Christians19jan06.shtml
January 19, 2006.

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael
To: <Editor@educate-yourself.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 6:21 AM
Subject: Christians

I was reading your page on Bible believing Christians where the person asked about the great rapture and Revelations (or that's a bit I noticed skimming over it_ I must have missed something on it but closed it and cannot find it now, although I do acknowledge that you seem to have what some might consider a more pluralistic or flexible understanding of spiritual things - not sure one can categorise your views at the speed I read the page and its irrelevant what I think of your views I'm just wondering if I can get a better handle on the point you were making at the end of the page which I though would make sense thinking about it late - it hasn't

I've got to say I've always had a fairly specific view on what a Christian is and is not

you said something about Christians who believe the only way to heaven was through Jesus.

isn't that the only definition of a Christian and vice-versa isn't that what a Christian believes - so in other wards how could someone believe that and not be a Christian or even how could one claim to be a Christian and not believe that might get me the answer I should be looking to read I suppose if you have time to answer that.

puzzled

Michael

----- Original Message -----
From: "Educate-Yourself" <editor@educate-yourself.org>
To:"Michael
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 4:03 AM
Subject: Re: Christians

Hi Michael,

You're not stating your questions very clearly so I can't really respond until you clarify more, but I will respond to one question below which I can understand.

Concerning Jesus and going to heaven. I'm not sure you paraphrased my statement accurately, but I'll give you a general response to your question. Before I do that, though, please remember that you wrote to me and asked me to answer your question. I'm not interested in debating or getting into an argument about anything. You can believe whatever you wish to believe.

I view being a Christian to mean that you subscribe to the advice given by Jesus while on earth. You primarily subscribe to His teachings and philosophy on how to live your life. You are a follower of Jesus' teachings. That's how I define being a Christian. Every other concocted "requirement" to be a Christian or get into heaven has been devised by men to serve an ulterior purpose of control and manipulation. And that will include most of the 'requirements' which Pastor So & So says is necessary to do in order to be "saved" by Jesus.

We all came from the spirit world when we entered a human body as a new baby. We all return to the spirit world when we die. There is a place in the spirit world where true Christian believers get together after dying called "Heaven" because that's where they WANT to go after they die and EXPECT to go and therefore, they find themselves where they wanted, hoped, and expected to go and they can stay there just as long as they want. Hindus might expect to go to a blissful place called "Nirvana" and they will find themselves in that sort of place if that is their heart's desire. Old Vikings dreamed of going to Valhalla when they died and meeting up with Odin and sure enough, that's where they went. No matter who you are or what you believed while on earth, you will find yourself in the spirit world after you die. Those pathetic dopes who think there is "nothing" after you die are in for the biggest shock. I'd love to see the look on their faces when they get on the Other Side.

If you die a very violent and unexpected death, you will likely "rest" for a while to recover from the shock, but eventually you will "wake up" and be greeted by friends, relatives and guides who will explain to you what happened and re-orientate you to living in the spirit world again. If you had a peaceful, normal death, you will be consciously awake during the transition process from flesh back into spirit form. They say it takes about 3 days for the detachment process to complete, so your consciousness will remain close to earth during that time and you will most likely be checking in on friends and loved ones and probably attend your own funeral just to see how everyone is handling it. You still have your same body, but it's vibrating at a much higher frequency in the astral plane, so earth people can't see you or touch you, but you can see them OK. You will stay close to the earth as long as you feel a need to stay close, but when the time is right, you will want to move on to higher places in the spirit world and explore more.

Generally you will live in a "neighborhood" in the spirit world that matches your own level of spiritual advancement. If you were nasty person who did a lot of bad things to people during your lifetime, then I'm afraid that's the sort of "neighbors" you will have in the spirit world. And if you were a decent sort, then you will be pleasantly surprised to find that all of your neighbors will be on the same level of decency as you are and you'll be very happy and content living among your 'own'. While there isn't really a place called Hell, per se, your 'neighborhood' in the spirit world might be somewhat Hellish if you don't live according to the rules of decency. Even then, you aren't condemned forever to live in a bad neighborhood in the spirit world. As soon as you decide to become more loving and more charitable, you will move up to a better enighborhood, but it's harder to "advance" in the spirit world than here on earth, so souls are always eager to get back into human form so they can move up the ladder faster.

When you get to a point of spiritual advancement where you no longer need to learn the lessons that earth life offers, then you will move on to another type of planet where the living is much easier and far more pleasant than the strife we have to endure here on earth, but I should add that things are changing in that regard, as earth itslef is going to "graduate" and move into a higher plane of vibration and by default everyone who remains on earth or is born in future generations will enjoy a much more peaceful and loving relationship with each other.

Everything in existence is part of God, including us. We all have a part of God within us, even the Worst of the Worst. Nothing can live or even exist without God. Even Lucifer himself and all those who worship him have a part of God within them, even though they would prefer to deny that, it's still true. They would not exist otherwise. All beings are God's children. God loves all of His children and wishes us to learn to love and forgive as demonstrated by Jesus while on earth. God allows the Wicked to be wicked so that they might eventually wake up and realize just how dumb and tiring it is to be wicked and learn to come around to a more loving approach to life where things are much more pleasant and peaceful. There is no peace in the world of the Wicked, but there's in unlimited peace and joy in the world of truth, light and love. God condemns none of His children, but rather patiently waits for them to come around if they are stuck on the Merry Go Round of evil behavior. So the notion that only "chosen" Christians who fulfill requirement A,B, and C will be "saved". while everyone else gets condemned to Hell is nonsense. That idea is the misguided product of VISCIOUS, MEANSPIRITED confabulations of fundamentalist con artists.

Fundamentalist preachers USE the life of Christ as a launching pad to inculcate FALSE ideas and false beliefs about how we should conduct our lives and how we should view our brethren. Most preachers that I see on television or hear on the radio CONDEMN and cast judgment on others; totally opposite to what Christ taught. They concern themselves with matters of materialism, political gain, war justification, disparagement of groups who don't agree with them, etc., etc. while all the time shouting that "God" told them this or told them that.

If you want to follow Jesus teachings, then read His words yourself and see what He has to say. Turn within for enlightenment and come to your own conclusions. Forget about the distortions and lies being peddled by preachers. Talk to Jesus and God directly from within the quietude of your heart.

Jesus talks to those who will listen with a very quiet voice. You must become quiet, still, calm, and peaceful-and then listen. When you show yourself to be a sincere and dedicated student, the Teacher will make Himself known.

Regards, Ken

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael
To: "Educate-Yourself" <editor@educate-yourself.org>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 4:19 AM
Subject: Re: Christians

sure

thanks not just for the response but for an in depth and detailed response, which you could have just skimmed over, but you took your time to make a serious attempt to make sense of a question I'm not sure I've fully formulated..... does that even make sense -

I think you did grasp the essence of my query though

and yes you'll get no debate with me, I acknowledge I asked,

and also would suggest neither of us have the time or energy to be interested in a theological debate, why would I debate you when I'm perfect and right and ahhhhhh had you going there -

I only make the warning that if you get it wrong its not me you are accountable to ... - which I trust will be the same warning you might offer to me at some point in time ... there are some points I do wholeheartedly agree with you, and some I don't.... as for which I don't know if that matters so much the thing I'm getting as is thanks for making the points you did and letting me see these points from your perspective, that's quite a time out of your day to put that down for me so thanks

give me time to read them over a few more times and understand your points a bit better to see what they inspire in my learning, after that I may want to ask you some more questions, but I don't want to pursue a needless debate, and don't want to consume your time

I don't think we'll wholeheartedly agree on everything, but do enjoy the aspects you have highlighted.

Regards
michael

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